• Yaourt is marked as orphan in pacman


    Hi!

    I was trying to remove pacman orphans using pacman -Qtdq and I was a bit confuse to have yaourt packaged listed there. Is yaourt unsupported or something? Should I remove it? In other case, how can I delete yaourt from that list?

    I leave the complete orphans list here, the rest of the packages make sens to me:

    boost
    cython
    doxygen
    enca
    gstreamer0.10-good
    js17
    js38
    leveldb
    lib32-json-c
    libwnck3
    llvm35-libs
    mono-tools
    netcdf
    perl-file-basedir
    perl-io-string
    perl-test-pod
    perl-timedate
    python2-gobject
    qt5-tools
    swig
    telepathy-logger
    telepathy-mission-control
    webkitgtk
    xf86-input-evdev
    yaourt
    

    Thanks for the help.

  • with pacman -Qt i get a lot packages i would not uninstall too
    but with (clean up) sudo pacman -Rns $(pacman -Qtdq) it will not be included … i do not know why but

    To list all packages no longer required as dependencies (orphans):

    pacman -Qdt

    Is what you want…

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    [Li{u}n//u//{i}x] since 1988 - overcoming failure means success
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  • @fnc, some package you installed had yaourt listed as a dependency. When you removed that package, yaourt remained. Although I admit that is a strange dependency. But that’s the most plausible explanation, based on how the Arch package system calculates orphan packages.

    Should you uninstall it? Depends. On whether you want it or not.

    • You want to use it. In that case no need to uninstall. But you should not leave the package as an orphan either. So change its entry on the database to explicitly installed: $ sudo pacman -D --asexplicit yaourt.
    • You do not want it. In that case, uninstall it.
    • You don’t know if you want it. In that case uninstall it. Sooner or later you will want something to manage AUR packages. I personally recommend pacaur and strongly discourage yaourt.

    An aside note:
    You have an unusual amount of orphan packages. This is a sign you haven’t been uninstalling packages with the recommended method.

    Always uninstall with -Rns, or at the very least -Rs. This will normally reduce your orphan count to zero during the whole life of your system.

    Sometimes during AUR packages installation, it is possible for orphans to be created when an AUR package has a build dependency that you don’t have installed on your system. You will always be informed of this new orphan and you should uninstall the orphan dependency immediately after AUR package gets installed (again, always use -Rns).

  • @joekamprad said in Yaourt is marked as orphan in pacman:

    with pacman -Qt i get a lot packages i would not uninstall too
    but with (clean up) sudo pacman -Rns $(pacman -Qtdq) it will not be included … i do not know why but

    To list all packages no longer required as dependencies (orphans):

    pacman -Qdt

    Is what you want…

    If I run the clean up command you suggest sudo pacman -Rns $(pacman -Qtdq), yaourt is listed for uninstalling, so I didn’t continue.
    And if I run pacman -Qdt, yaourt is still listed.

  • @Krugar said in Yaourt is marked as orphan in pacman:

    @fnc, some package you installed had yaourt listed as a dependency. When you removed that package, yaourt remained. Although I admit that is a strange dependency. But that’s the most plausible explanation, based on how the Arch package system calculates orphan packages.

    Should you uninstall it? Depends. On whether you want it or not.

    • You want to use it. In that case no need to uninstall. But you should not leave the package as an orphan either. So change its entry on the database to explicitly installed: $ sudo pacman -D --asexplicit yaourt.
    • You do not want it. In that case, uninstall it.
    • You don’t know if you want it. In that case uninstall it. Sooner or later you will want something to manage AUR packages. I personally recommend pacaur and strongly discourage yaourt.

    An aside note:
    You have an unusual amount of orphan packages. This is a sign you haven’t been uninstalling packages with the recommended method.

    Always uninstall with -Rns, or at the very least -Rs. This will normally reduce your orphan count to zero during the whole life of your system.

    Sometimes during AUR packages installation, it is possible for orphans to be created when an AUR package has a build dependency that you don’t have installed on your system. You will always be informed of this new orphan and you should uninstall the orphan dependency immediately after AUR package gets installed (again, always use -Rns).

    That is the only thing it makes sense but it is a really strange dependency indeed.
    I’m used to use yaourt, so I’ll probably keep it, but I’ll take a look to pacaur.

    When I uninstall packages I use pacman -Rsnc or yaourt -Rsnc, so I don’t really get why there are so much orphans. I guess I have installed and uninstalled a lot of packages and maybe I have used Antergos for too long.

    Anyway, thanks for your explanation.

  • @fnc said in Yaourt is marked as orphan in pacman:

    Rsnc

    Never use -c. :(
    That option is destructive. It is like -s but will not perform any of the checks -s does, before deciding to remove dependencies. It is the worse choice you could have made to add to the -R command.

    There are rare cases for the use of -c. But they will almost always use it in conjunction with -u to mitigate somewhat the destructive nature of -c. But the rule is to never use it unless you know exactly what you are doing.

    The potential for -c to break your system when used in the way you do, is far too great and it’s a 100% certainty within a reasonable time frame. Always use -Rns or -Rs. That’s the golden rule.

  • [offtopic]

    I wouldn’t be so categoric about a -c option’s harmfullness.

    Before removing a package it’s enough to:

    • study with attention its reversed dependencies tree
    • thoroughly read proposed removals before confirming them for pacman

    In fact, I’m almost always use -Rcnssu. Only in very rare cases I use a simple -Rnssu.

    [/offtopic]

  • alt text

    [updates once a week] = [90% less problems]
    [Li{u}n//u//{i}x] since 1988 - overcoming failure means success
    howto-install-antergos
    how to add system logs
    i3 GNOME

  • @Krugar @just So both of you agree that -Rns is the less harmful way to remove a package, and in case that -c argument is needed, I should use -Rcnssu better than -Rsnc. Is that correct? I’ll have a careful look to c in order to understand it better.

    Thanks!

  • @fnc said in Yaourt is marked as orphan in pacman:

    Is that correct?

    More or less

    For precaution, follow @Krugar’s advice, and use -Rnssu.. It will probably leave some unneeded pkgs in the system, but almost surely won’t remove those that are needed.

    To remove as much as possible, and get the most clean system, use -Rcnssu. Be careful though. The command is not suitable for removing metapackages. For example, if you use it to remove antergos-kde-setup metapackage, for example, it will go to remove almost all Kde.

    It’s not enough just carefully read what pacman is going to remove with -c. Even before running pacman, study the reversed dependencies tree of a package you want to remove. It will give you the full overview of what will become removal candidates for pacman.

    The best choice - don’t install packages you don’t need, or packages with a huge number of dependencies, packages from AUR. Don’t install anything :laughing: !

  • I don’t see the point in using -Rcnssu. It’s unnecessary long, complicated and is redundant. Don’t complicate simple things. And -Rnssu is simply dangerous!

    1st
    -cuss is the same as -ss. So there is no need to use both. Either use one or, better yet, use none! See next.

    -Rnssu is dangerous! It will also uninstall explicitly installed packages. You almost never want to do this.

    2nd
    Without -c, -cu, or -ss you still get informed of broken dependencies. The big and important difference is that you don’t get offered to still uninstall. Pacman will simply stop and not leave you hanging on a Yes/No prompt that can lead to accidental hitting of a wrong key.

    $ sudo pacman -Rns shadow
    checking dependencies...
    error: failed to prepare transaction (could not satisfy dependencies)
    :: util-linux: removing shadow breaks dependency 'shadow'
    $ _
    

    3rd
    -ss, -cu (and especially -Rnssu!) will remove explicitly installed packages if they happen to be a dependency of the target package or one of its dependencies. This is almost never what you want to do. There is no reason for me to be forced to go through an uninstallation list looking for those, in order to know if I need to cancel the operation, when I can just avoid the whole problem entirely by issuing -Rns.

    Take a look for instance when I use this command on my systemt o remove firefox:

    $ sudo pacman -Rnssu firefox
    checking dependencies...
    
    Package (10)            Old Version  Net Change 
    
    mime-types              9-1            -0.06 MiB
    mozilla-common          1.4-4           0.00 MiB
    noto-fonts              20170920-2    -59.81 MiB
    noto-fonts-extra        20170920-2   -232.49 MiB
    ttf-bitstream-vera      1.10-11        -0.56 MiB
    ttf-droid               20121017-5    -15.31 MiB
    ttf-freefont            20120503-4    -10.30 MiB
    ttf-liberation          2.00.1-7       -3.89 MiB
    ttf-ubuntu-font-family  0.83-3         -4.00 MiB
    firefox                 56.0-1       -155.82 MiB
    
    Total Removed Size:  482.24 MiB
    

    Suddenly it wants to also remove many important fonts of my system that I installed myself and need for other applications. No way!

    4th
    -ss and -cu have a greater potential for generating complicated output that is harder to understand, especially by newcomers. They are never a good advice to give a newcomer to Arch. Compare the command on 2nd argument above with the output of: sudo pacman -Rnsscu shadow. You’ll go insane.

    In conclusion:

    -ss and -cu are good tools to have in our arsenal. But they are “special case” tools and problem fixing tools. They are also advanced tools. They are not generic tools for daily Arch maintenance.

    It is important to look at Arch wiki, search the Arch forums for advise given over the years on this very matter. It’s been repeated through exhaustion. And I tend to follow what time proved right.

    So my final advice is: Use -Rns or -Rs and leave the other options for advanced pacman usage and under the very specific cases they were designed for. This is how you use a computer. Keep It Simple.

  • This is one of the most interesting and informative discussions I have come across in here. Thanks, guys!

    1.Antergos Linux KDE plasma / Gnome 2.Ubuntu 17.10 64bit Unity
    Intel Core2 Duo CPU P8400 2.26GHz‖ RAM 3908 MiB ‖ Dell Inc. 0F328M - Dell Inc. Latitude E6500
    Intel Mobile 4 Series Chipset Integrated Graphics [8086:2a42] {i915

  • @Krugar @just Thanks for your help!
    I’ll start using -Rns as it seems to be the less potentially harmful way to remove packages.

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