• Dead in the Water after Kernel Update Today (3.19.2-1)

    What separates the Men from the Boys. Fedora vs. Antergos

    This morning began with a nice cup of coffee and I commenced going on line. I’ve been energized of late with the discovery of Antergos.

    But this am I got a punch in the stomach. Antergos saw an update needed to be applied. I let is do its update noting it included an update to Arch kernel 3.19.2-1, so when the update finished, I rebooted into the new kernel.

    I was taken directly into the Desktop with no greeter login/password intervention. That seemed odd. Then I noticed I had no network connection despite nm-applet running. There wasn’t an option to edit my connections either – it was blank.

    I’ve run into this with rolling releases before, and particularly with kernel updates.

    I plugged a cat5 cable in and got a connection, then search on Antergos forums to see if there was any help. None. It was early and probably I was among the few ‘lucky souls’ who tried to update.

    Joe Average is simply ‘dead in the water’ when this happens. They don’t have the requisite knowledge to recover. My Netbook became a paper weight. I was miffed.

    So, I got to thinking about the real virtue of ‘rolling releases’. My conclusion is, when it works it is fine. When things go a kilter your system can become borked, unusable.

    Looking back to how Microsoft does it, they have restore points.
    You have to tip your hat to them for having years ago seen the importance of such a feature.

    With Antergos you get a sausage. Okay, I see a post:

    with suggestions for a ‘work-around’ to roll-back the kernel.

    This is not elegant to say the least. And who knows if it would even work depending on the ‘state’ of each machine (no two being the same).

    So, I am reassessing sipping my coffee and decide, I am going back to Fedora. This would and cannot happen on that platform.

    Better yet, I went ahead and configured the partitions with Btrfs. And, installed yum-plugin-fs-snapshot which automatically snapshots your filesystems during updates.

    The benefit of this plugin comes exactly in this situation – a rollback to the last ‘snapshot’ or restore point can be made in 5 seconds.

    Disaster avoided. Imagine this happening in an Enterprise environment.
    You’d be put up against the nearest wall and shot. Enterprise cannot have downtime period the frickin’ Amen. No excuse is acceptable.

    This is what separates the Men from the Boys.

    I do love what the developers of Antergos have done thus far, but is wouldn’t survive in the real business world. It’s okay for hobbyists.

    So with yum, you get package management with history roll-back capability and all applications are precompiled by the vendor, not you.

    With Arch and yaourt, the work of doing source code compiling and build are deferred until you choose to install and then depending on the application you wait minutes to as much as hours for the build and then final compress into an Arch package is complete ‘before’ you can install. It’s a most novel approach, but it is a trade-off.

    If I need an app that isn’t rpm packaged, I can rpmbuild it myself or just build the tar.gz. That’s not an option for ‘Joe Six-Pack’ and they ‘should’ have a ‘recovery’ option in Antergos. They don’t. And that’s a major factor to consider when you pick which Distro to go with.

    Seriously, I think Antergos is filling the biggest unmet need with Arch – making ‘Arch made Easy’ for Everyone. I think the installer is slick, seamless and professional. I hope the developers understand and are reading my comments. You are doing great work. Keep working and make Antergos the best Distro. I think you can do it.

    Good Luck. – Dietrich

  • @Dietrich-Schmitz You could downgrade kernel, or take snapshots/backups up your system. You have everything available to you via archlinux repos that you do on fedora. If you don’t want to bork your system be cautious when updating and take precautions in case something goes wrong.


    Some helpful links. Well which ever distro you choose is up to you, with gnu/linux options are plentiful.

  • @detrimental , this is a case of needing to understand the individual you are dealing with. Dietrich was likely just warming up a bunch of click-bait for his next online project. Note the special effects, such as the italicized ‘headline’ in his post. Whilst he spends a lot of time trying other distros, I am of the opinion he only does it so he can then chastise everyone for not using his distro du jour, which is now Fedora. But make no mistake about it, if spitting blood at Fedora presents Dietrich some possible click-bait, his tune will change in a New York minute. Dietrich is as predictable as the sun rising tomorrow.

    As I recall, he once took Fedora to task on his old Linux Advocates site, so even Fedora is not exempt from his eccentric writings.

    I’ll not add my own opinions to the mix, but Schmitz started his Linux Advocates site to promote Linux. In the beginning, the site showed some promise. Katherine ‘Linux Girl’ Noyes was associated with the site to some degree, but that didn’t seem to end well after Schmitz started alienating everyone who disagreed with him. After seeing Schmitz go off on a few people, and then reading his pleas for donations to financially support his Blogger site (!!!), I lost all track of him. Actually, I just learned a few minutes ago that he shut down his Linux Advocates site, earlier this year. Shows how big a blip that one was on the radar, aye?

    After reading Dietrich’s gripe, I logged out and updated all four of my Antergos machines. And yes, all four machines were updated with the 3.19.2-1 kernel, so after the updates were finished, I re-booted all four machines. And, as expected, e-v-e-r-y-t-h-i-n-g is working as anticipated.

    Of course, this kind of spoils all the dramatic effect of Dietrich’s post, because this ‘Joe Average’ is plugging right along, with all four machines. And trust me, I am the definition of average, because I have this funny, little demand for my operating system choice - rather than me having to work on it, I require it works for me. Which is why I use Antergos. Actually, that is why I have been using Antergos for a year. (With Btrfs, by the way.) Antergos works, it works well, and I do not have to fuss with it. The only problem I have with Antergos is how long it took me to find it. If Antergos was causing problems with any kind of updates, I would not be here. It really is that simple.

    I installed Fedora 21.5 in a VM, when it was released. It is a rather interesting distro, but when I realized I was spending time on Google, trying to sort how to set up RPM Fusion, when I could simply be using Antergos, I clearly saw what separates the men from the boys. I think I might still have Fedora in a VM, in case I ever wanted to play with it. But since I spend most of my time working with my systems, I use what works for me. If I ever have some play time, I’ll toy with Fedora some more.

  • I’ve been using Antergos for several weeks, no problems and always shining and updated. And kernel 3.19.2 of course. Still, I understand that Antergos is Arch, newest software all the time and the AUR at hand. If something should ever go wrong I dual boot with other distros and I know that any possible problem would be fixed in a few clicks. And by the way I think neither Arch nor Fedora target an enterprise environment. How silly would be for an ‘enterprise’ to use latest and cutting-edge software like Arch and Fedora do. Just use Debian instead, you’ll have old software and be fine for the rest of your life.

  • @ant77 said:

    And by the way I think neither Arch nor Fedora target an enterprise environment. How silly would be for an ‘enterprise’ to use latest and cutting-edge software like Arch and Fedora do. Just use Debian instead, you’ll have old software and be fine for the rest of your life.

    Exactly. Well said.

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